• August 28, 2021 at 10:15 am #121057
    Tom Ham
    Participant

    He turned 50-60 hours at the shop he just left. Certified in six areas. Sufficient experience. College grad. Solid GPA. Eagle Scout. Clean looking. Good language skills. Seemed friendly.

    The interview appointment was agreed upon yesterday. It would be today at 9:00 AM. At 9:15 I texted him. No reply. At 9:33 he shows up. I asked if I could help him. He said he is here for a job interview. I asked him if he meant the 9:00 interview. He said yes but he was stuck in heavy traffic this Saturday morning in Grand Rapids, Michigan. Maybe so.

    I told him the interview has been canceled. I told him that if he can’t show up on time for the interview what are the odds he would show up on time for work. I also told him he just blew a great job opportunity. He did. Ours is a first-class operation. We always have more to do to make it better, but we are miles ahead of most shops.

    Bottom line – do not hire this guy. The late show was only one of the dozens of possible red flags. You know what they are. If you smell the slightest hint of something that drives you nuts, broom ‘em. It doesn’t matter how short on help you are right now. Hiring the wrong people will place the end of your tunnel farther off.

    Tom - Shop Owner since 1978

    August 28, 2021 at 2:06 pm #121061
    andre remillard
    Participant

    For me the very first red flag is with all of those supposed qualifications and knowing what the industry is like ,why in the world would any employer let him leave?

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    August 28, 2021 at 2:28 pm #121062
    Richard Zaagman
    Participant

    Funny story somewhat related. 50 years ago at 18 I drove up and down my street and applied at all the gas stations along the way. At one of the shops I was told to get a haircut and he’d consider me. Long hair was part of my identity so I moved on and took a job at another gas station a mile away. 4 years later, still a long haired hippy, I returned to that shop owner that told me to get a hair cut and bought his company at the age of 22. 47 years later, same location, 10 more bays, projecting 3.5 million in sales this year. Oh yeah, I finally cut my hair too. Can’t judge a book by its cover, can’t always rely on first impressions.

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    August 28, 2021 at 3:39 pm #121064
    Tom Ham
    Participant

    Not always.

    But you have better odds of winning Powerball than having an employee show up promptly for work after showing up half-hour late for an interview with no call, text, or email. No apology when he sauntered in, either.

    I sent you his resume. As they say, good luck with that.

    Tom - Shop Owner since 1978

    August 30, 2021 at 12:33 pm #121104
    cmassoll
    Participant

    Been their!! Its a mater of comfort, he may work out well and on the other hand may not. Hire slow, Fire fast. Some techs think they walk on water & their shoes don’t smell. Its like buying a house, you get your heart set on it and the deal falls through. You eventually find another to buy. Looking back your so happy that you have what you got and not the first pick. You find your self in a better position and happier. Their will ALWAYS be a NEXT. I would continue to get applications for a week or two after hiring.

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    August 30, 2021 at 12:43 pm #121106
    joecval
    Participant

    Tom, I’m sorry but this is horrible advice. With all the good qualities on this candidate that alone should justify an interview. An interview is nothing more than an intentional conversation and tells you a lot more about a person than being late to an interview will. I get the spirit behind be on time for an interview but to say you’re late and goodbye without interviewing him is cutting off your nose to spite your face in this hiring climate.

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    August 30, 2021 at 1:47 pm #121108
    Joe Mazur
    Participant

    While I agree with the spirit of what is said here, I also think that this is bad advice. The way that you treated that technician for being late is uncalled for. And now he is telling all of his technician friends what a jerk that owner was over at that shop. Technicians talk more than shop owners do, so all of us owners do need to be mindful of our reputation. Even though he was late, taking time to chat with him may have shown you a different side of him, and as Dick said, you cant always judge a book by its cover. A little grace and kindness goes a long way.

     

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    August 30, 2021 at 2:14 pm #121110
    Tom Ham
    Participant

    Tom, I’m sorry but this is horrible advice. With all the good qualities on this candidate that alone should justify an interview. An interview is nothing more than an intentional conversation and tells you a lot more about a person than being late to an interview will. I get the spirit behind be on time for an interview but to say you’re late and goodbye without interviewing him is cutting off your nose to spite your face in this hiring climate.

    Joe,

    Someone, maybe you, will hire this guy and the games will commence. 101 excuses why he is late this time. Finally, ways will be parted and he will move on to the next place. I’ve given the benefit of the doubt on the late crap one too many times. I’m done. It never works.

    Now, if he had walked in profusely apologizing, I may have interviewed him. 1 Late – no – very late. 2 No call to say running late. 3 No immediate mention of it when he walked in. Three strikes, you’re out! 🙂

    Tom - Shop Owner since 1978

    August 30, 2021 at 2:29 pm #121113
    Tom Ham
    Participant

    While I agree with the spirit of what is said here, I also think that this is bad advice. The way that you treated that technician for being late is uncalled for. And now he is telling all of his technician friends what a jerk that owner was over at that shop. Technicians talk more than shop owners do, so all of us owners do need to be mindful of our reputation. Even though he was late, taking time to chat with him may have shown you a different side of him, and as Dick said, you cant always judge a book by its cover. A little grace and kindness goes a long way.

     

    Joe,

    My advice was not on how to treat anyone. My advice was strictly on whether or not to hire him. I will stick with what I said. Hiring him would be a bad decision.

    Now, should I have sat down with him, briefly mentioned his tardiness wrapped in love and understanding? No. That would be silly. A reasonably responsible adult can show up on time, or call, or apologize. A reasonable person should expect to get a less than cuddly response when he performs so poorly.

    Will he tell his buddies what a rotten S.O.B. I am? Probably. Won’t be the first time! Eventually, I may hire one of his buddies. The one who heard his story and said to himself: “What kind of idiot shows up half an hour late for a serious, high-paying job interview?”

    Tom - Shop Owner since 1978

    August 30, 2021 at 2:53 pm #121115
    Jeff Ruffing
    Participant

    I hate people who are late…
    But it sounds like he had a decent hair cut….and was articulate. I’d interview him anyway.

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    August 30, 2021 at 2:55 pm #121117

    I hate people who are late…
    But it sounds like he had a decent hair cut….and was articulate. I’d interview him anyway.

    Now that I think about it, the haircut was good.

    Maybe I should call him… 😉

    AutomotiveManagementNetwork.com
    [email protected]
    616-340-2380

    August 30, 2021 at 2:59 pm #121119
    Jeff Ruffing
    Participant

    For discussion, a similar point…..

    A very successful shop owner that I know has said that any applicant that he reaches out to….if their “mailbox is full” or he gets the message “you have reached a user whose mailbox is not properly set up” he writes them off, tosses the resume and never thinks about them again.
    He said that he’s never had one of those people ever work out in the past.

    Your thoughts on that?

     

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    August 30, 2021 at 3:17 pm #121121
    Tom Ham
    Participant

    For discussion, a similar point…..

    A very successful shop owner that I know has said that any applicant that he reaches out to….if their “mailbox is full” or he gets the message “you have reached a user whose mailbox is not properly set up” he writes them off, tosses the resume and never thinks about them again.
    He said that he’s never had one of those people ever work out in the past.

    Your thoughts on that?

     

    I think that it is currently very difficult to toss out any candidate. The absolutes will be different for every shop owner. I agree with your shop owner friend. I have my list. Late is one. No potheads, either. Did that ride – not again.

    I think we should be tougher in general. The lack of standards and lack of strong response has made things worse for employees and employers. I recall how my parents would groan when we were in a restaurant and there was a little brat nearby with mama constantly repeating: “Please don’t do that, Honey.” Of course, he ignored her. I only misbehaved once in a restaurant. At least as a child.

    I wonder how many shop owners have sat down and reviewed the reasons their last 10, 20, or more employees are no longer there. If we all did so, and are open-minded to learn (that’s another topic), I suspect our approach to hiring would be quite different.

    Tom - Shop Owner since 1978

    August 30, 2021 at 3:26 pm #121123
    joecval
    Participant

    For discussion, a similar point…..

    A very successful shop owner that I know has said that any applicant that he reaches out to….if their “mailbox is full” or he gets the message “you have reached a user whose mailbox is not properly set up” he writes them off, tosses the resume and never thinks about them again.
    He said that he’s never had one of those people ever work out in the past.

    Your thoughts on that?

     

    I think that it is currently very difficult to toss out any candidate. The absolutes will be different for every shop owner. I agree with your shop owner friend. I have my list. Late is one. No potheads, either. Did that ride – not again.

    I think we should be tougher in general. The lack of standards and lack of strong response has made things worse for employees and employers. I recall how my parents would groan when we were in a restaurant and there was a little brat nearby with mama constantly repeating: “Please don’t do that, Honey.” Of course, he ignored her. I only misbehaved once in a restaurant. At least as a child.

    I wonder how many shop owners have sat down and reviewed the reasons their last 10, 20, or more employees are no longer there. If we all did so, and are open-minded to learn (that’s another topic), I suspect our approach to hiring would be quite different.

    Very difficult to toss out any candidate? Unless he’s 30 minutes late to an interview 🙂

    Sorry Tom, I couldn’t help myself.

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    August 30, 2021 at 3:44 pm #121125

    I see this more than ever, A young person that was not held accountable in the past will do this (Mom likely ran home to get the forgotten homework or lunch!) I agree- we are also a premium shop and accountably starts at the top.

    Frank M Scandura III

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    August 30, 2021 at 4:26 pm #121127
    joecval
    Participant

    As an owner our decisions attract dollars to our business or repel dollars from our business. Did you do the math on what not talking to this tech could cost you?

    55 hours billed per week x ELR of $115 = $6325 in labor revenue.

    If your parts labor split is 50/50 that’s $12,650 of weekly revenue.

    At 57% GP that’s $7,210 in GP dollars per week x 4.33 weeks in a month = $31,219 per month in gross profit dollars. If that doesn’t sting the $374,628 of yearly GP dollars that will go toward overhead and then add to your net income really will.

     

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    September 1, 2021 at 5:00 pm #121143
    Paul Seeley
    Participant

    So true, a phone call explanation, a hefty apology and the interview continues. He felt like you needed him more than he needed you.

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    September 2, 2021 at 10:39 am #121149
    J.P. Glenn
    Participant

    So true, a phone call explanation, a hefty apology and the interview continues. He felt like you needed him more than he needed you.

     

    When talking about an interview, I think the “3 strikes and your out” works well. He had 3 strikes before it started!

    #1 was showing up late

    #2 was not calling when he knew he would be late (everyone has a cell phone)

    #3 was not a sincerely apologizing once he did show up

    #4 was not asking for the job/second chance (maybe that is the same as #3?)

    The 2 most important qualities to us when looking for an employee are honesty and reliability. Most of the rest can be taught. Of course there are many others to look at, but if I don’t feel you are 100% honest and reliable, I’m not hiring you. Obviously this particular tech failed the reliability test in a big way.

    Good luck to all those who are looking for a new hire. I hope you find the right person and make sure that you TAKE CARE OF THE GOOD ONES!

     

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